F999 - Marilyn's Unique Actress/publicity Designation At 20th Century Fox Share | Options

[LasseK]

A few months back I decided to look into the various numberings that you encounter on Marilyn photos. Strangely enough I haven't come across any explanation of these numbers anywhere else, why I guess that you will be as pleased by this post as I was in finding it out.

This topic deals with one in particular, one which you all have seen, but maybe not yet have fully understood the meaning of.
Namely this one  F999.jpg ( 20.45K )Number of downloads: 53
- the "F999-" numbers.

(I will post on some other numbering systems regarding Marilyn pictures in other threads later. For instance publicity pictures for each film, basically shots of scenes from the picture or maybe backstage, were numbered by the film's unique publicity designation. More on this later.)

By sampling all my MM photos bearing the F999-designation and looking at pictures of other film stars at various film studios, I soon realized:
"F999" simply and actually means Marilyn's unique (actress/publicity) designation at Fox!
From the very beginning to the end.

The "F" means Fox (for instance Paramount studios used "P"), "999" is the unique (actress/publicity) number Marilyn got when she signed or when Fox started releasing publicity pictures of her. (What the middle "s" stands for, I am not sure.)

So, somewhere there may be a "F999-s-1" photo of Marilyn, but I haven't seen it and it would be great to find out which the first one was.

All this is of course a great find to us and any collector. By arranging these numbered photos in order we will have yet another means of dating shoots and pictures.

The earliest F999s that I have so far are these:
F999-s-22 and F999-s-23
 F999_s_022.jpg ( 48.75K )Number of downloads: 173
 F999_s_023.jpg ( 54.78K )Number of downloads: 185


The following ones are from various outdoor shoots ranging from F999-s-41 to F999-s-82.
(You'll find the corresponding numbers in the file names, where you will also notice that I've added a "0" to the last number, like in "F999-s-022" - that's just because this makes the pictures get sorted in the right order in my folders.)

 F999_s_041.jpg ( 25.54K )Number of downloads: 126
 F999_s_044.jpg ( 32.96K )Number of downloads: 134

 F999_s_046.jpg ( 225.07K )Number of downloads: 126
 F999_s_049.jpg ( 497.37K )Number of downloads: 125

 F999_s_050.jpg ( 47.97K )Number of downloads: 101
 F999_s_056.jpg ( 1.08MB )Number of downloads: 99

 F999_s_060.jpg ( 34.98K )Number of downloads: 115
 F999_s_063.jpg ( 123.55K )Number of downloads: 87

 F999_s_070.jpg ( 130.68K )Number of downloads: 158
 F999_s_074_retouche3.jpg ( 75.54K )Number of downloads: 126

 F999_s_082.jpg ( 22.84K )Number of downloads: 142


(The ES-page froze on me while uploading pics, I hope the ones I alreday did come through. Till later)

I have to stop here for now. Please add a post and I will continue.

Lasse

This post has been edited by LasseK: Aug 26 2008, 11:16 AM

[MissCaswell]

That's so cool! Now I will have to start looking through my folders for that number. Thank you for doing the research!

[LasseK]

Thanks, Erica.

The following ones, ranging from F999-s-87 to F999-s-96, are from the Sorell and the Baby Sitter shoot.

 F999_s_087.jpg ( 33.61K )Number of downloads: 93
 F999_s_088.jpg ( 71.67K )Number of downloads: 108

 F999_s_093_1.jpg ( 278.02K )Number of downloads: 93
 F999_s_094b.jpg ( 401.33K )Number of downloads: 93

 F999_s_096_1.jpg ( 355.59K )Number of downloads: 93


These are from F999-s-103 up to F999-s-108 on the Fox lot.
 F999_s_103.jpg ( 52.48K )Number of downloads: 113
 F999_s_106.jpg ( 52.23K )Number of downloads: 135

 F999_s_107.jpg ( 42.79K )Number of downloads: 132
 F999_s_108.jpg ( 54.93K )Number of downloads: 135


This is F999-s-111.

 F999_s_111.jpg ( 56.39K )Number of downloads: 129


F999-s-120.
 F999_s_120_3.jpg ( 49.64K )Number of downloads: 91


F999-s-128.
 F999_s_128.jpg ( 72.5K )Number of downloads: 116


Golf pictures in different outfits from F999-s-133 to F999-s-136.
 F999_s_133.jpg ( 41.61K )Number of downloads: 82
 F999_s_134_1.jpg ( 116.11K )Number of downloads: 120

 F999_s_136.jpg ( 24.78K )Number of downloads: 88


Finally for now, from the Sailor hat shoot, F999-s-142.
 F999_s_142e.jpg ( 39.54K )Number of downloads: 114


These represent all 1940s F999:s (before the All About Eve publicity pictures) that I have found so far.
(There are of course many other non-F999 Marilyn publicity pictures from the 1940s from non-Fox films. I will post on these later in other threads.)

I guess most of you, just like me, will have a number of other pictures belonging to the various shoots above. However I have only posted the ones with clear and readable numbers.

If you've got more F999:s from the 1940s or in better quality, please post.

I will get back to you later with what I have of F999:s from the 1950s.

Lasse

This post has been edited by LasseK: Aug 26 2008, 11:11 AM

[BoAlex]

Thanks, Lasse, it helps a lot. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/clapping.gif)

[Lacrymosa]

Thank you Lasse ! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/clapping.gif)

[Mezzo]

Lasse, I don't know if you already have this photo, but I found this reference on the internet:

290. Marilyn Monroe Portrait from There’s No Business Like

Show Business (20th Century-Fox, 1954) Gelatin silver glossy 8 in. x 10

in. print of Marilyn Monroe. Portrait number P999-S-424 imprinted in

negative by hand on the recto border lower right.


This is a link to the catalog. The picture is item #290, on page 15 of 48. The picture is not very good quality, so I hope you already have a better one. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/bye1.gif)
http://www.profilesinhistory.com/catalogs/...32_49-96web.pdf

[LasseK]

Lasse, I don't know if you already have this photo, but I found this reference on the internet:

290. Marilyn Monroe Portrait from There’s No Business Like

Show Business (20th Century-Fox, 1954) Gelatin silver glossy 8 in. x 10

in. print of Marilyn Monroe. Portrait number P999-S-424 imprinted in

negative by hand on the recto border lower right.
This is a link to the catalog. The picture is item #290, on page 15 of 48. The picture is not very good quality, so I hope you already have a better one. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/bye1.gif)
http://www.profilesinhistory.com/catalogs/...32_49-96web.pdf

Thanks Mary, I do have that picture and will post it when I get to the 1950s F999:s.
They have misread it - its not "P999-", its "F999-".

Thanks anyway. It's a great catalogue.

Lasse

[Mezzo]

You're welcome! I'm glad that you have a bigger, better quality picture. This one was pretty grainy, from what I could see. Here's a better link to that photo and others of Marilyn: http://www.liveauctioneers.com/item/5467358


This post has been edited by Mezzo: Aug 26 2008, 08:50 PM

[suusmarie]

Wonderful (IMG:style_emoticons/default/thumbup.gif) ! Thanks (IMG:style_emoticons/default/clapping.gif) !

[abeautifulchild]

Lasse, as always you are truly incredible! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/marilynbybrandon_190.gif)
Thank you yet again.

[LasseK]

Correction!

In an earlier post, regarding for instance a number like "F999-s-134". I said:
"The "F" means Fox (for instance Paramount studios used "P") "

It seems I was mistaken. Look at these:
 209264142_o.jpg ( 63.98K )Number of downloads: 61
 Jayne_Mansfield_Note_the_G.jpg ( 288.83K )Number of downloads: 90


These are 20th Century Fox publicity numbers for Hildegard Neff and Jayne Mansfield.
Both actresses got their Fox contracts much later than Marilyn, in the early 1950s.

As you can see, Neff's picture reads "G127-s-28" and Jayne's reads "G232-s-33".

By this I conclude that the "F" actually doesn't refer to "Fox" but simply is part of an alphabetical system used for the register of Fox actors/actresses. Marilyn simply got the "F999-" and after that, instead of going "F1000-" etc, they went to "G..." etc..

Now, I haven't had the time and opportunity to check out this theory on earlier Fox' film stars, like if there actually are any "A...", "B..." etc. actors/actresses.

(An alternate explanation could be that the "F" oiriginally stood for "Fox", but (only) at the end of the run of the first thousand actors/actresses (Marilyn's "F999-"), they decided to make it alphabetical by introducing the "G-" series, if you see what I mean.)

Lasse

This post has been edited by LasseK: May 11 2009, 02:20 PM

[Lacrymosa]

Thank you Lasse. I was pretty sure too that the "F" meant Fox... since I've seen pictures of other actresses that were numbered, and where for example "MG" refered to MGM and "P" to Paramount.
I'm browsing through my files and will let you know if I find Fox pictures with another letter...

[size="3"][/size]

This post has been edited by Lacrymosa: May 11 2009, 07:48 PM

[Lacrymosa]

Here is what I've found so far :

The lowest number I've found is "F6", which was used for Shirley Temple :
 F6ShirleyTemple02.jpg ( 44.09K )Number of downloads: 42
 F6ShirleyTemple01.jpg ( 33.59K )Number of downloads: 48


She got her contract with Fox in 1933.

The thing I don't really know is if the numbers were attributed in chronogical order. For example, Tyrone Power's number was "F266". He was signed in 1936. Whereas Alice Faye's number was "F15" and she was signed in 1935.
 F266TyronePower03.jpg ( 66.29K )Number of downloads: 39
 F15AliceFaye.jpg ( 50.06K )Number of downloads: 39



I am more confused than before ! (IMG:http://www.everlasting-star.net/boards/style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif) If it's not chronological, how did they choose the number ?
But I think you can be right Lasse when you say that the "G" came when they didn't have anymore "F"' left.
I haven't found yet pictures with another letter.

[dazzledent]

Interesting.

My suggestions -I think Shirley Temple signed with Fox at age 6. Alice Faye was born in 1915.
Tyrone Power is more tricky...his sister was born on the 26th... ??? Maybe it was quite a random system?

[suusmarie]

Just found these ones on Ebay (IMG:http://www.everlasting-star.net/boards/style_emoticons/default/coolio.gif)

Attached File(s)

 F999_s_318.jpg ( 129.01K )Number of downloads: 105
 F999_s_322.jpg ( 135.03K )Number of downloads: 91
 F999_s_369.jpg ( 129.31K )Number of downloads: 87
 F999_s_370.jpg ( 133.41K )Number of downloads: 120
 F999_s_375.jpg ( 157.91K )Number of downloads: 116
 F999_s_379.jpg ( 116.61K )Number of downloads: 94
 F999_s_416.jpg ( 112.66K )Number of downloads: 101
 F999_s_484.jpg ( 116.35K )Number of downloads: 105

 

[mmmMarilyn]

AMAZINGGGGG, Gorgeous!!!

[Guest_jennie2000_*]

This is a great thread, thank you Lasse, it helps sorting some pictures out (IMG:http://www.everlasting-star.net/boards/style_emoticons/default/thumbup1.gif) But what could C stand for?
It's not publicity for (Columbia) but MGM? And I don't think it's the initial of the photographer...

(IMG:http://img718.imageshack.us/img718/527/51aj2b.th.jpg)

[suusmarie]

(IMG:http://www.everlasting-star.net/boards/style_emoticons/default/thumbup1.gif)

Attached File(s)

 F999_s_392.jpg ( 51.53K )Number of downloads: 94
 F999_s_394.jpg ( 16.93K )Number of downloads: 74
 F999_s_397.jpg ( 30.57K )Number of downloads: 77
 F999_s_408.jpg ( 86.88K )Number of downloads: 81
 F999_s_411.jpg ( 57.46K )Number of downloads: 71
 F999_s_413.jpg ( 73.09K )Number of downloads: 88
 F999_s_414.jpg ( 21.21K )Number of downloads: 96
 F999_s_416.jpg ( 112.66K )Number of downloads: 82
 F999_s_436.jpg ( 19.76K )Number of downloads: 97

 

[LasseK]

This is a great thread, thank you Lasse, it helps sorting some pictures out (IMG:http://www.everlasting-star.net/boards/style_emoticons/default/thumbup1.gif) But what could C stand for?
It's not publicity for (Columbia) but MGM? And I don't think it's the initial of the photographer...

(IMG:http://img718.imageshack.us/img718/527/51aj2b.th.jpg)

I don't know what the C exactly refers to. But the 1479 is the number for the film "Asphalt Jungle". I have publicity pictures both with C1479-, S1479- and with no letters at all, just plain 1479-.

All Marilyn (solo) publicity pictures are C1479- and so far I haven't seen any "C"-pictures of anyone else.

All "S"-pictures that I have are studio publicity pictures of Marilyn together with someone else from the cast.

All "no letter"-1479- pictures seem so far to be of scenes from the picture.

Lasse

[hollywoodcindere...]

This is a fantastic thread - very useful! thanks a bunch! (IMG:http://www.everlasting-star.net/boards/style_emoticons/default/smile1.gif)